168、当天使与世人交谈时，他们从不以适合世人的属世观念来表达自己，因为这些观念都来自时间、空间、物质以及类似的事物，而是用属灵的观念，这些都来自天使内外的状态及其变化。然而，当这些属灵的天使的观念流入世人时，它们立刻转变成适合世人的属世观念，而这些属世观念与那些属灵观念完美地相对应。天使和世人都不知道这些发生，但这就是进入世人的一切天堂流注的特性。有些天使蒙允许更近地进入我的思维，甚至进入有大量源于时空的事物的属世思维。然而，他们此时什么也不明白，随即退了出来。他们退出后，我听见他们谈论说，他们刚才陷在黑暗中。
[2]我被允许从亲身经历中了解到，天使对时间是多么无知。有一位天堂来的天使，他能进入诸如世人所拥有的属世观念中，后来，我与他交谈，就像世人与世人那样交谈。太初，他不知道我所说的“时间”为何物，于是，我不得不告诉他有关“时间”的一切：太阳似乎围绕着地球转，并产生了岁月；年岁又如何分为四季、分为月和周；一日如何分为二十四时，这些时间又如何通过固定的间隔循环，所有这一切如何成为时间的源头。听到这些，他很惊讶，说他对这些事一无所知，只知道何为状态。
[3]在与他交谈时，我还说，天堂里没有时间，这在世上众所周知，因为人们说的话似乎表明他们知道这点，在说到死去的人时，会说这些人“离开了时间的事物”，“超越了时间”，意思是他们离世了。我还说，有些人知道，时间就其源头而言就是状态，因为他们知道，时间完全与他们所在的情感的状态相一致：“欢娱嫌夜短，寂寞恨更长”，对那些处在愉悦、快乐状态的人来说，时间显得短暂；对那些处在不快乐、忧伤状态的人来说，时间显得漫长；当处在希望或期待状态时，时间则多变。这让有学问的人探究时间和空间是什么，其中一些人认识到时间属于属世之人。
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168. 当天使与世人交谈时, 他们从不以适合世人的属世概念来表达自己, 因为所有属世概念都来自时间, 空间, 物质, 以及类似事物. 他们会运用属灵概念, 因为所有属灵概念都来自在天使之内和之外的状态及其各种变化. 然而, 当属灵的天使概念流入世人时, 它们瞬间自动变成适合世人的属世概念, 而这些属世概念恰好与属灵概念相对应. 天使和世人都没有意识到这一点; 但这就是天堂进入世人的一切流注. 某些天使蒙允许更近地进入我的思维, 甚至进入含有大量源于时空物质的属世思维. 然而, 他们此时什么也不明白, 随即退出了; 他们退出后, 我听见他们谈论说, 他们陷入黑暗.
我蒙恩通过亲身经历得知, 天使对时间是如何一无所知. 有一位天堂来的天使可以进入诸如世人所拥有的属世概念. 后来, 我与他如世人与世人那样交谈. 一开始, 他不知道我所说的“时间”为何物. 于是, 我不得不告诉他太阳如何看似绕地球旋转, 并产生年, 日; 年份如何由此分为四个季节, 又如何分为数月和数周, 一日如何分为二十四个时辰; 这些时期又如何通过固定间隔反复出现, 以及这一切如何成为时间的源头. 闻听此言, 他感到很惊讶, 声称他对这类事物一无所知, 只知道何为状态.
在与他交谈的过程中, 我提到世人其实知道天堂没有时间. 因为他们谈论死亡的人时, 似乎知道这一点, 声称他们抛下世俗事物, 超越时间了, 意思是他们离世了. 我还说, 有些人知道就起源而言, 时间就是状态, 因为他们知道, 时间与他们情感的状态完全吻合; 对那些处于欢喜, 快乐状态的人来说, 时间显得短暂; 对那些处于不悦, 沮丧状态的人来说, 时间显得漫长; 当处于希望或期待状态时, 时间则千差万别. 因此, 这使得学者追问何为时间和空间, 有的甚至发现时间是属世人的一个属性.
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168. 與人談話的天人們從不使用適合我們世人的物質概念, 這些觀念都源自時間, 空間, 物質及類似範疇。他們使用心靈的概念, 一切心靈概念源於狀態以及狀態在天人內外的變化。不過, 當天人的心靈概念流入我們時, 便立時自然而然地轉變成適合我們的物質概念。天人不知道此事, 我們也不知道, 但的確如此;天國的一切流入就是這樣注入到我們。
某天人被允許潛入了我的思想, 一直進到大片被時空觀念包裹的想法。那時他們完全不知為何物, 便立刻退出了。我聽到退出後他們的談話, 說他們剛剛掉入了一片黑暗當中。
通過親身經歷, 我瞭解到天人對時間是如何一無所知。曾有一位天人, 他的秉性使他能啟進入物質的概念, 類似我們。後來我與他當面交流, 起初他不瞭解我所說的"時間"為何物。我便告知太陽如何看似繞地球轉動, 造成日復一日, 年復一年的交替變化, 由此而劃分一年四季, 十二月份, 一日十二時辰, 且有固定的間隔, 時間由此而來。聽到這些他很驚訝, 稱他從未聽說有時間存在, 只知有狀態存在。
在交流的過程中, 我提到世人其實知道天國沒有時間的概念。他們談論的時候, 似乎就知道這一點, 因為當有人死時, 我們就說他們離開現世和越越時間, 意思是說他們離開這個世界。我還說, 有些人知道時間原是狀態, 因為他們注意到, 時間的體驗正好與心靈的狀態表現一致。當人快樂的時候, 時間似乎過得飛快;當人沮喪的時候, 時間顯得相當漫長;當人憧憬的時候, 時間又似乎變化不定。學者因此追究時空的性質, 有的甚至確定時間只是物質之人的屬性。
168. The angels who talk with us never use the natural concepts that are proper to us, all of which derive from time, space, matter, and the like. They use spiritual concepts, all of which derive from states and their various changes in and around angels. However, when the angelic concepts, which are spiritual, flow into us, they change instantly and spontaneously into those natural concepts proper to us which exactly correspond to the spiritual ones. Neither the angels nor we are aware of this; but still, this is how all inflow of heaven occurs for us.
There were some angels who were let very intimately into my thoughts, all the way into natural ones that contained a mass of material from time and space. However, since at that point they could not understand anything at all, they promptly withdrew; and after they had withdrawn I heard them talking, saying that they had been in darkness.
[2] I have been allowed to know from experience what angels' ignorance of time is like. There was a particular individual from heaven whose nature did allow him to be let into natural concepts such as we have. I talked with him afterward, person to person, and at first he did not know what it was that I was calling "time." So I actually had to tell him how the sun seems to travel around our earth and make years and days, and that as a result, years are divided into four seasons and into months and weeks, and days into twenty-four hours, and that these times recur at fixed intervals. This gives rise to our expressions for time. He was astonished when he heard this, and said that he had not known that kind of thing, but only what states were.
[3] In the course of our conversation I mentioned that it was known in our world that there is no time in heaven. We do actually talk as though we knew, since when people die, we say that they have left temporal things and have passed beyond time, meaning that they have left our world. I also said that it is known by some that times are states in origin because they recognize that times are experienced in precise accord with the states of affection we are caught up in. They are short for us when we are engaged in pleasant and cheerful pursuits and long when we are engaged in distasteful and depressing ones, and variable when we are in hope or expectation. As a result, scholars are asking what time and space are, and some of them even recognize that time is an attribute of the natural person.
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168. When angels speak with men they never express themselves in the natural ideas proper to man, all of which are from time, space, matter and things analogous thereto, but in spiritual ideas, which are all from states and their various changes within the angels and outside them. Nevertheless, when these angelic ideas which are spiritual inflow with men, they are turned in a moment and of themselves into the natural ideas proper to man corresponding perfectly to the spiritual ideas. Neither angels nor men know that this takes place, but such is the nature of all the influx of heaven with man. There were angels who were permitted to enter more nearly into my thoughts, even into the natural thoughts in which were many things from time and space. But as they then understood nothing, they suddenly withdrew, and after they had withdrawn I heard them talking and saying that they had been in darkness.
[2] It has been granted me to know, by experience, how ignorant the angels are about time. There was a certain one from heaven who was able to enter into natural ideas, such as man has, and with him I afterwards talked as man with man. At first he did not know what it was that I called time, and I was therefore obliged to tell him all about it, how the sun appears to be carried round our earth, and to produce years and days, and how years are thereby divided into four seasons, into months and weeks, and how days are divided into twenty-four hours, and that these times recur by fixed alternations, all this being the source of times. On hearing this, he was surprised, saying that he knew nothing about such things, but only what states are.
[3] In speaking with him, I also said that it is known in the world, for men speak as if they knew, that there is no time in heaven, saying of those who die that they leave the things of time and that they pass out of time, meaning by this, out of the world. I also said that some know that times in their origin are states, for they know that times are entirely in accordance with the states of the affections in which they are, short to those who are in pleasant and joyous states, long to those who are in unpleasant and sorrowful states, and various in a state of hope and expectation. This leads learned men to enquire what time and space are, and some of them know that time belongs to the natural man.
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168. When angels speak with men they never express themselves in natural ideas proper to man, all of which are from time, space, matter, and things analogous thereto, but in spiritual ideas, all of which are from states and their various changes within the angels and outside of them. Nevertheless, when these angelic ideas, which are spiritual, flow into men, they are turned in a moment and of themselves into natural ideas proper to man, that correspond perfectly to the spiritual ideas. Neither angels nor men know that this takes place; but such is all influx of heaven into man. Certain angels were permitted to enter more nearly into my thoughts, even into the natural thoughts in which there were many things from time and space; but as they then understood nothing they suddenly withdrew; and after they had withdrawn I heard them talking, and saying that they had been in darkness.
[2] It has been granted me to know by experience how ignorant the angels are about time. There was a certain one from heaven who was able to enter into natural ideas, such as man has; and after he had done this I talked with him as man with man. At first he did not know what it was that I called time, and I was therefore obliged to tell him all about it, how the sun appears to be carried about our earth, and to produce years and days, and how years are thereby divided into four seasons, and also into months and weeks, and days into twenty-four hours; and how these times recur by fixed alternations, and how this is the source of times. On hearing this he was surprised, saying that he knew nothing about such things, but only what states are.
[3] In speaking with him I added that it is known in the world, for men speak as if they knew that there is no time in heaven, saying of those who die that they "leave the things of time," and that they "pass out of time," meaning by this out of the world. I said also that some know that times in their origin are states, for they know that times are in exact accord with the states of their affections, short to those who are in pleasant and joyous states, long to those who are in unpleasant and sorrowful states, and various in a state of hope and expectation; and this therefore leads learned men to inquire what time and space are, and some know that time belongs to the natural man.
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168. Angeli qui cum hominibus loquuntur, nusquam loquuntur per ideas naturales homini proprias, quarum omnes sunt ex tempore, ex spatio, ex materiali, et ex illorum analogis. sed per ideas spirituales quarum omnes sunt ex statibus et eorum mutationibus variis intra et extra angelos sed usque angelicae ideae, quae spirituales, cum influunt apud homines, vertuntur momento et ex se in ideas naturales homini proprias spiritualibus prorsus correspondentes quod ita fiat, angeli non sciunt, nec homines: talis etiam est omnis influxus caeli apud hominem. Fuerunt angeli qui propius admissi sunt in cogitationes meas, et usque in naturales, in quibus erant plura ex tempore et spatio; sed quia tunc nihil intellexerunt, subito recesserunt, et postquam recesserunt audivi illos loquentes, dicendo quod in tenebris fuerint.
[2] Qualis ignorantia angelis sit de tempore, datum est mihi scire per experientiam. Erat quidam e caelo, qui talis erat ut quoque posset in ideas naturales, quales homini sunt, admitti; cum quo ideo locutus sum postea sicut homo cum homine. Ille primum non scivit quid esset quod appellarem tempus; quare prorsus informare debui, quomodo sol apparet circumferri circum nostram tellurem, ac annos et dies facere, et quod inde anni distinguantur in quatuor tempora, et quoque in menses et septimanas, ac dies in viginti quatuor horas, et quod illa tempora statis vicibus recurrant; et quod inde tempora quibus auditis miratus est, dicendo quod talia non noverit, sed quid essent status.
[3] Inter loquendum cum illo, etiam dixi quod sciatur in mundo quod in caelo non sit tempus, loquuntur enim homines sicut sciant nam dicunt de illis qui moriuntur, quod relinquant temporaria, et quod transeant e tempore, per quod intelligunt, e mundo. Dixi etiam quod a quibusdam sciatur quod tempora in sua origine sint status, ex eo quod sint prorsus secundum status affectionum in quibus sunt brevia illis qui in amoenis et laetis sunt, longa illis qui in amoenis et tristibus, ac varia in statu spei et exspectationis: et quod ideo eruditi inquirant quid tempus et spatium et quod etiam quidam sciant quod tempus sit naturali homini.