3658. namely, by casting him down, and whirling his head in fantasy, at which the pontiff complained, then casting him down into a vat, but did this quickly, because he was in that inward fantasy by the torments of which the pontiff was treated and complained pitifully. David told him that he was David, and concerning the Lord, said that he is holding Him bound, and that he now rules in heaven, asking the pontiff whether he would like to worship him as god, in which case he would show him his kingdom. Hearing this the pontiff declared that David is a saint, thereupon denying the Lord and following David. But he wanted to see his kingdom, but was not able and the pontiff came to the conviction that if he denied the Lord, whose vicar he was, he would be no one, thus coming to that conviction. When David noticed this - for in that state he can at once sense the convictions of another - he turned him into a cloud and threw him far away in the cloud, which I saw. In the cloud he thought he was nothing, for he became practically invisible, but still, from the end of that cloud he spoke with me. This shows what persuasions are like when they conflict.
3658. He was tortured by being cast down, and by being sent into the [infernal] tun, 1and that with great quickness, because of his [David's] being in such an interior phantasy. When the pontiff thus severely dealt with complained of these torments, David said to him that he was David; and concerning the Lord, that he held him bound, and that one only was to reign in heaven, at the same time asking why be wished to worship him [the Lord] as God, and proffering to show him his own kingdom. Upon hearing this the pontiff said that David was holy; he therefore denied the Lord and followed David; but when he wished to see his kingdom, he could not, and [being thus disappointed on this score], it came into the pontiffs persuasion, that if he should deny the Lord, whose vicar he had been, he would become nobody; wherefore he actually came into this persuasion, which when David perceived - for he could instantly perceive in that state the persuasions of another - he turned him into a cloud, and in this form, which I saw, cast him off to a distance, in which condition he fancied himself nothing, for he was then hardly visible, but yet from the extremity of the cloud he conversed with me. From this it may appear what is the quality of persuasions when they conflict with each other.
Footnotes:
1. A species of punishment in the other world, of which an account is given, AC 947, 948.
3658. nempe dejiciendo, et terebrando ejus caput per phantasias, de quo conquestus pontifex, tum eum dejiciendo et in tonnam mittendo, sed hoc cito, quia in phantasia tali interiore, ex quibus cruciatibus pontifex misere tractatus et conquestus, David ad eum dixit quod David esset et de Domino, quod eum vinctum teneat, et quod nunc regnet in coelo, quaerens an colere eum vellet pro deo, ei monstraturus regnum suum, quo audito pontifex dixit quod David sit sanctus, abnegavit itaque Dominum, et sequutus Davidem, sed voluit ejus regnum videre, sed non potuit, et venit pontifici in persuasionem, si abnegaret Dominum, cujus vicarius fuerat, quod sic nullus, quare in persuasionem istam venit, quod cum animadvertit David, nam illico percipere potest in eo statu alterius persuasionem, eum in nubem vertit, et projecit a se longius in nube, quam vidi, in qua se putabat nihil, nam tunce inconspicuus, sed usque a nubis istius extremo, loquutus mecum; exinde constat quales sunt persuasiones cum concurrunt.