4696. I saw such [simple spirits] and was given the opportunity to speak with them; there were both men and women. I thought at first, when they were feeling well-disposed, or it was morning, that there could be a heaven for those who are lacking concepts of truth and good. But it was shown that they were so changeable that so long as they were engaged in some matter pertaining to the natural senses they could not be led. They then rather took up any opinions whatever so that nothing was defined. When they turned, they turned their mind, like a rotating wheel, to an opposite position and believed that to be true. From this is clear that a base plane of truths of faith, or of concepts of good and truth in both doctrine and life, that is, in act, ought to be formed in the world, and that otherwise their state is easily turned and evil.
4696. Such spirits were seen; and it was granted to speak with them, females as well as males. I supposed, at first, that, when in good, or it was morning, heaven could be granted to those who are destitute of the knowledges of good and truth; but it was shown how vacillating they were, so that they could not be led while they were in any sensual-natural state, but they then laid hold of any opinions whatever, so that all things were indeterminate. When one turned himself then he changed his mind, like a revolving wheel, to the opposite, and believed this to be true. Hence it is patent, that a plane must be formed from truths of faith, or from knowledges of good and truth, both in doctrine and life, that is, by act, in the world; and that, otherwise, their state is vacillating and evil.
4696. Tales visi sunt, et cum illis datum est loqui, tam mares quam faeminae, putavi prius cum in bono seu mane fuit, quod posset dari coelum illis qui absque cognitionibus veri et boni sunt, sed ostensum, quam versatiles essent, ut non duci possent dum in aliquo sensuali naturali essent, sed tunc arripiebant opiniones quascunque, sic ut omnia essent indeterminata, cum se verteret, tunc mutabat mentem sicut rota versatilis, in oppositum, et hoc credebat verum, inde patet, quod planum ex veris fidei seu ex cognitionibus boni et veri tam doctrina quam vita, hoc est, actu, formari debet in mundo, et quod alioquin status illorum est versatilis et malus.