8413.“是要用饥饿杀死这全会众啊”表他们因缺乏快乐和良善而正在灭亡。这从“杀死”、“会众”和“饥饿”的含义清楚可知：“杀死”是指丧失生命，在此是指丧失由快乐和良善所构成的生命，因为一个人的生命就在于这些（参看3607，6767节）；“会众”是指那些属于属灵教会的人（7843节）；“饥饿”或“饥荒”是指良善的缺乏（参看5893节），在此是指“饼”所表示的低级趣味的良善的缺乏（8410节）。因为当滋养属灵生命，或灵之生命的东西被夺走时，饥饿或饥荒就会出现。
有必要对此中情形作一个简短的阐述。当构成属灵生命的仁之良善要被建立时，已构成属世生命的属低级趣味的快乐就被夺走。当这种快乐被夺走时，此人就进入试探。他以为他若失去属这些趣味的快乐，就会失去一切生命，因为他的属世生命就在于这种快乐，或他所称之为的良善。但他不知道，当这种生命的快乐被夺去时，主就会灌输属灵的快乐和良善，以取而代之；这种良善就是“吗哪”所表示的。前一种良善或快乐则由“埃及地的肉和饼”来表示，该良善或快乐的丧失由“饥饿”来表示。
不过，要清楚理解的是，正经历重生的人不会失去属肉体和低级心智趣味的快乐，因为重生之后，他完全享有这种快乐，甚至比以前更充分，不过是成反比关系。重生之前，属低级趣味的快乐是他生命的一切；但重生之后，仁之良善成了他生命的一切；这时，属低级趣味的快乐充当一种手段，并充当一个终极层面，使得属灵良善及其幸福和极乐终止于其中。因此，当秩序要颠倒过来时，以前属低级趣味的快乐就会消退，不再是快乐；而来自一个属灵源头的一种新快乐则被灌输以取而代之。
Potts(1905-1910) 8413
8413. To kill this whole congregation with hunger. That this signifies that they were expiring from a lack of delight and of good, is evident from the signification of "killing," as being to deprive of life, here, of that which is from delight and good, for in these the life of man consists (see n. 3607, 6767); from the signification of "the congregation," as being those who are of the spiritual church (n. 7843); and from the signification of "hunger," as being a lack of good (see n. 5893), here of the good of pleasures, which is signified by "bread" (n. 8410); for when that which nourishes the spiritual life, or the life of the spirit, is taken away, hunger results. How the case herein is shall be briefly told. [2] When the good of charity, which makes the spiritual life, is to be insinuated, the delight of the pleasures which had made the natural life is removed. When this delight is removed, the man comes into temptation, for he believes that if he is deprived of the delight of pleasures, he is deprived of all life, because his natural life consists in this delight, or good, as he calls it. But he does not know that when this delight of life is removed, spiritual delight, or good, is insinuated by the Lord in its place. It is this good that is signified by the "manna;" the former good or delight being meant by the "flesh and bread in the land of Egypt," and the privation of this being meant by "hunger." [3] But it is to be carefully observed that the man who is being regenerated is not deprived of the delight of the pleasures of the body and lower mind, for he fully enjoys this delight after regeneration, and more fully than before, but in inverse ratio. Before regeneration, the delight of pleasures was everything of his life; but after regeneration, the good of charity becomes everything of his life; and then the delight of pleasures serves as a means, and as an ultimate plane, in which spiritual good with its happiness and blessedness terminates. When therefore the order is to be inverted, the former delight of pleasures expires and becomes no delight, and a new delight from a spiritual origin is insinuated in its place.
Elliott(1983-1999) 8413
8413. 'To kill all this congregation with hunger' means that they were perishing owing to the lack of delight and of good. This is clear from the meaning of 'killing' as depriving of life, at this point life made up of delight and good, for a person's life consists in these, dealt with in 3607, 6767; from the meaning of 'congregation' as those belonging to the spiritual Church, dealt with in 7843; and from the meaning of 'hunger' or 'famine' as a lack of good, dealt with in 5893, at this point the good of lower pleasures, meant by 'bread' in 8410. For when that which nourishes spiritual life, or the life of the spirit, is taken away, hunger or famine occurs.
[2] A brief statement showing the nature of all this needs to be made. When the good of charity, which is to constitute a spiritual life, is to be installed, the delight belonging to lower pleasures, which has constituted a natural life, is taken away. And when this delight is taken away the person enters into temptation. The person thinks that if he is deprived of the delight which belongs to those pleasures he is deprived of all life; for the life of his natural has consisted in that delight or good as he calls it. But he does not know that when this delight in which his life has consisted is taken away the Lord instills spiritual delight and good instead; and this good is what is meant by 'the manna'. The previous kind of good or delight is meant by 'flesh and bread in the land of Egypt', and the deprivation of it by 'hunger'.
[3] But it should be thoroughly understood that a person undergoing regeneration is not deprived of the delight belonging to bodily and mental pleasures, for after regeneration he has full enjoyment of such delight, fuller than he had before, but in inverse proportion. Before regeneration the delight that belongs to lower pleasures was the all of that life; but after regeneration the good of charity becomes the all of life, and when it does so the delight belonging to lower pleasures serves as a means, as something embodying spiritual good and the happiness and bliss that go with it. When therefore order is to be inverted, the previous delight belonging to lower pleasures fades away and ceases to be anything, and a new delight from a spiritual origin is instilled instead.
Latin(1748-1756) 8413
8413. `Ad occidendum omnem congregationem hanc fame': quod significet quod ex defectu jucundi et boni exspirarent, constat ex significatione `occidere' quod sit privare vita, hic quae ex jucundo et bono, nam vita hominis in illis consistit, de qua n. 3607, 6767; ex significatione `congregationis' quod sint qui ab Ecclesia spirituali, de qua n. 7843; et ex significatione `famis' quod sit defectus boni, de qua n. 5893, hic boni voluptatum, quod per `panem' n. (x)8410 significatur, cum enim id quod nutrit vitam spiritualem, seu vitam spiritus, aufertur, fit {1} fames {2}. 2 Quomodo cum hoc se habet, paucis dicendum: cum bonum charitatis insinuandum est, quod vitam spiritualem {3}facit, tunc removetur jucundum voluptatum, quod fecerat vitam naturalem; cum hoc jucundum removetur, tunc homo in tentationem venit; credit enim, si privatur jucundo voluptatum, quod deprivetur omni vita, nam vita ejus naturalis in illo jucundo aut bono, ut id vocat, constitit; sed nescit quod cum removetur hoc vitae, loco ejus insinuetur a Domino jucundum et bonum spirituale; hoc bonum est quod per `mannam' significatur; prius bonum seu jucundum intelligitur per `carnem et panem in terra Aegypti,' ac privatio ejus per `famem.' 3 At probe observandum quod homo qui regeneratur {4}non privetur jucundo voluptatum corporis et animi, hoc enim jucundo post regenerationem plene fruitur, et plenius quam prius, sed in inversa ratione; {5}jucundum voluptatum ante regenerationem fuit omne vitae illius, at post regenerationem bonum charitatis fit omne vitae, et tunc jucundum voluptatum inservit pro medio et pro ultimo plano in quo bonum spirituale cum suo felici et beato terminatur; cum itaque invertendus est ordo, tunc prius jucundum voluptatum exspirat et fit nullum, et novum ex spirituali origine loco ejus insinuatur. @1 i tunc$ @2 i, ex qua laborat vita illa$ @3 faciat$ @4 nusquam$ @5 jucundum voluptatum quod ante regenerationem fuit omne vitae illius et finis, usque adeo ut exstinxerit bonum vitae spiritualis, at post regenerationem bonum charitatis fit omne vitae ejus et finis$