1321. The subjects of those reasonings were mainly three, which likewise followed in order. The first was, whether the statement ought to be taken literally that the apostles would sit on 12 thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel [Matt. 19:28, Luke 22:30], as many maintain. Those who take that to be the meaning were embroiled in that confusion, and at the same time they were afraid that heaven was falling to ruin, as they say, 1being anxious lest [the apostles] be dislodged from their judgment seats.
Many of the apostles, who were the mediums of those who take that statement literally and defend it, were also there, while some of the apostles were not. For when they are let back into the state of their bodily life, which happens when they are let back from the heaven of angels to the heaven of spirits, they are like that, and defend those words. For in bodily life they had believed no otherwise than that they would judge the 12 tribes of Israel. And because this is entirely contrary to the inward meaning of the words, they become very indignant, demanding that they be judges. Many other spirits who love such uproars and like to arouse the apostles stir them up against the Church, and against the inward meaning, and even more against the very inward meaning.
Footnotes:
1. Perhaps referring to Matt. 24:35, and the same statement in Mark and Luke.
1321. The subjects of their reasonings were principally three which followed in succession. The first was whether it is to be understood according to the letter that the apostles were to sit upon twelve thrones and judge the twelve tribes of Israel [Matthew xix 28 ]. This was maintained by many who thence seize upon such a meaning in that confusion, and at the same time also from the fear that heaven would fall, as they say, being in some anxiety lest [the apostles] should be cast down from their judgment seats. Many of the apostles, who were the subjects of those who thence seize and defend such a meaning, were also there; some were not. For when they return into the state of their bodily life, which happens when they are sent back from the heaven of angels into the heaven of spirits, they become such that they defend these literal ideas, for in the life of the body they had believed no otherwise than that they would judge the twelve tribes of Israel; and because that is altogether opposed to the interior sense of these words they become very indignant, and then demand that they should be judges. They were also aroused by very many spirits who love such tumults, and who desire to arouse the apostles against the Church and the interior sense, and especially against the more interior sense.
1321. Objecta ratiocinationum 1
erant imprimis tria, quae quoque succedebant, primum erat, num secundum literam intelligendum, quod apostoli super 12 thronis sederent, et judicarent duodecim tribus Israelis [Matth. 19:28, Luc. 22:30], quod defendunt multi; erant ii, qui talem sensum inde capiunt, in confusione ista, et tunc simul ex timore, quod rueret coelum, ut ajunt, in quadam anxietate, quod deturbarentur ex suis judiciis, plures apostolorum etiam simul erant, qui erant subjecta eorum, qui talem sensum inde capiunt, et defendunt; praeter aliquos apostolorum, qui non ibi erant, nam dum ii in statum vitae corporis remittuntur, quod fit dum e coelo angelorum, in coelum spirituum, remittuntur, tales sunt, ut ea defendant, non enim aliter in vita corporis crediderunt, quam quod judicarent 12 tribus Israelis; et quia id interiori sensui verborum prorsus repugnat, indignantur valde, postulantes tunc, ut judices essent, perplures etiam eos excitant, qui amant similes tumultus, et apostolos contra Ecclesiam et sensum interiorem, et magis contra intimiorem excitare cupiunt.
Footnotes:
1. This is how it appears in J.F.I. Tafel's edition; the Manuscript has ratiocinatum