5221. They sit at the right, which is toward the south, around a table and consider how God must be worshiped if He gives them the power of controlling things on earth for Him, and how if He does not. And they think about how they can make it appear to the common people that they give heaven to them, and many other things whose intent is to rob the Lord of all power of saving the human race and to possess this power. I have heard them talking among themselves when they heard about the life of faith and love, [saying] that they never knew that faith and love would give them any kind of life, either to their understanding of things or to what they wanted to do, but that a person possesses both of these equally without faith and love. In the world they had not at all understood that the things that pertain to faith, and so to Divine truth, make the life of the intellect spiritual, and that those that pertain to love, and so to Divine good, make the life of the will heavenly with a person, and consequently make wisdom and happiness. For them such things were then delusions, meaningless fantasies. I have heard them speaking among themselves in this way. They added that they had put the life of the intellect in devising plots well, so that they could get what they wanted. Consequently they had put it in tricks and malice. They called such things intelligence and wisdom. And they had put love's life in the love of commanding over others and of gaining the whole world.
5221. They sit at the right, that is towards the south, around a table, and deliberate concerning worship: as to how God should be worshipped in the event of His granting them the power of governing on earth in His stead, and how they should act, in case He did not grant it. Also, how they should manage so that, to the common people, it may appear that heaven is given by them: and very many other things. They do all these things to the end that they may take away from the Lord all power of saving the human race, and have the power themselves. I heard them saying to one another, when they [once] heard about the life of faith and love, that they never knew that faith and love gave them any life, either intellectual or voluntary; but that man just as much possesses each without faith and love as with. They did not at all understand, when in the world, that those things which are of faith, and thus of divine truth, constitute the spiritual intellectual life, and that those things which are of love, and thus of divine good, constitute the celestial voluntary life with man, and hence his wisdom and happiness. Such things were then a laughing-stock with them, as empty phantasies. In such wise, I heard them speaking together. They added, that they placed intellectual life in well-devising matters so as to obtain what they wish, thus in arts and wickedness. Such things they called intelligence and wisdom; and they placed the life of their love in the love of ruling over others and acquiring possession of the whole world.
5221. Sedent ad dextrum quod est versus meridiem circum mensam, et deliberant de cultu, quomodo colendus Deus, si potestatem illis det pro Ipso dominandi in terra, et quomodo si non det; tum quomodo faciant, ut coelum appareat vulgo dari ab illis, et perplura, omnia pro fine habent ut derogent Domino omnem potestatem salvandi genus humanum, et quod illis potestas sit; audivi illos inter se loquentes, cum audiverunt de vita fidei et amoris, quod nusquam sciverint quod fides et amor darent illis aliquam vitam, nec intellectualem nec voluntariam, sed quod homo possideat utramque aeque absque fide et amore; quod illa quae fidei sunt, ita quae veri Divini, faciant vitam intellectualem spiritualem, et quod illa quae amoris sunt, ita quae boni Divini faciant vitam voluntariam coelestem apud hominem, et inde sapientiam, et felicitatem, prorsus non intellexerunt in mundo, talia tunc illis ludibria fuerunt, ut phantasiae inanes; taliter inter se loquutos esse audivi: addebant quod posuerint vitam intellectualem in bene machinandis rebus, ut obtineant quae volunt, ita in artibus, et malitia, talia vocabant intelligentiam et sapientiam; et vitam amoris in amore imperandi super alios, et lucrandi totum mundum.