224、此外，我还与一位讲道者谈论那些在圣殿听道的人所处的圣洁的状态。他说，每个人的敬虔、热诚和圣洁都取决于由爱和信所形成的内层，圣洁本身在爱和信中，因为主的神性在其中。他还宣称，他对脱离爱和信的外在圣洁一无所知。当他想到这种脱离爱和信的外在圣洁时，他说，或许它是外表中的假冒圣洁，又或者是凭技巧或虚伪所获得的东西，出于对自我和尘世之爱的假火会点燃它，并使它持续下去。
------------
224. 我还与其中一位牧师谈论那些在教会聆听讲道的人所处的神圣状态. 他说, 每个人的敬虔, 虔诚和神圣都取决于其属于爱和信的内层; 事实上, 神圣本身处于爱和信, 因为主的神性在其中. 他还说, 他不知道何为脱离爱和信的外在神圣; 对于这种神圣, 他想了想说, 或许它是模仿的表面神圣, 是某种凭技艺或虚伪所获得的事物; 这种神圣被出于对自我和尘世之爱的假火点燃和维持.
------------
224. 我曾與一位傳道者談論在教堂聆聽佈道的人所表現出來的聖潔氣質。天人說, 根據內在仁與信的水準, 每個人都具有某種恭敬, 虔誠和聖潔的氣質, 因為主的神性顯於仁與信之中。天人還表示, 在仁與信之外, 他們不知有何為聖。外表有可能顯現出模仿的聖潔, 就是通過技巧或偽善而得之類, 源於對自我和塵世之愛欲的假火可以點燃並使之持續。
224. I also talked with one particular preacher about the holy state characteristic of people who are listening to preachers in church. He said that there is something reverent, devout, and holy in all of us depending on the deeper levels of our love and faith, since there is something holy within our love and faith because the Lord's divine [presence] is there. He added that he did not know what anything holy was apart from these. Further, he said that when he thought about something externally holy apart from these, it might possibly be something that mimicked holiness in outer appearance, something acquired either by skill or by hypocrisy. A deceptive fire arising from love for oneself and the world would generate and present this kind of appearance.
------------
224. Moreover, I talked with a preacher about the holy state in which those are who listen to the preachings in the temples. He said that every one is pious, devout and holy in accordance with his interiors, and these interiors are [formed] of love and faith in which is what is holy itself because the Divine of the Lord is in them. He also declared that he knew nothing about outward holiness apart from love and faith. When he thought of external holiness separate from love and faith, he said that possibly it would be something counterfeiting holiness in outward appearance, either acquired by art or hypocritical, and that some spurious fire from the love of self and the world may kindle it and keep it going.
------------
224. I have also talked with one of the preachers about the holy state in which those are who listen to the preaching in the churches. He said that everyone is pious, devout, and holy in harmony with his interiors, which pertain to love and faith, for holiness itself is in love and faith, because the Divine of the Lord is in them. He also said that he did not know what outward holiness is apart from love and faith; and when he thought about it he said that perhaps it is something counterfeiting holiness in outward appearance, either conventional or hypocritical; and that such holiness is kindled and sustained by spurious fire from the love of self and the world.
------------
224. Locutus etiam sum cum quodam praedicatore de sancto in quo sunt qui audiunt praedicationes in templis: et dixit, quod pium, devotum, et sanctum, sint cuivis secundum interiora ejus quae sunt amoris et fidei, quoniam in his ipsum sanctum est quia Divinum Domini; et quod non sciat quid sanctum externum absque illis: et cum cogitavit de sancto externo absque illis, dixit, quod forte sit aliquid quod mentitur sanctum in externa specie vel arte acquisitum vel hypocriticum et quod aliquis ignis spurius ex amore sui et mundi exsuscitet et sistat tale.