1246. About the hellish gang in the dark Chamber
You may see spoken above [909] about the deceitful hellish gang in that room almost at the back, where they do nothing but plot together how they can trick and cheat anyone who comes along. I spoke with this gang, and some expressed surprise that anyone was allowed to speak with them. But I replied that it was granted me to do this, to speak with even the worst devils, because they cannot hurt me at all. If it were otherwise and they were able to, then I would feel repulsion and fear; but there can be no fear of them in me because I am protected by the Lord. Therefore, it has never been forbidden me to talk with devils, if they wanted to talk with me, so that I might also learn what their life is like and what hell is like. Besides this I was also able to tell them that through my conversation with them, they can learn what they are like. For they, being carnal, do not know otherwise than that they are in the life of the body; so that in this way, they can be taught about themselves. And further, because they are in hell they are rather to be pitied than to have any harm done to them; and if I were to speak harsh words such as some souls have brought along with them from bodily life, then punishments would be added upon punishments for them, and this would be contrary to compassion and true caring. For it is a Christian quality to wish well even to them. And besides, some were people known to me in life, and I had not thought that they would become infernal [spirits].
1246. CONCERNING THE INFERNAL CREW IN THE DARK CHAMBER
Concerning the infernal, deceitful crew in this chamber almost at the back, you may see above [nos. 775-776. They do nothing there but plot how they can fraudulently deceive those who come to them. I spoke with this crew, and some spirits wondered at this being permitted but I replied that it was granted me to speak with even the worst devils, because they can do nothing to injure me. It would be different if they could injure me for then aversion and fear are present, but I can have no fear of them because I am kept in safety by the Lord. For this reason it never has been forbidden me to speak with devils if they wanted to speak with me, in order that I might know the nature of their life and the nature of hell. Moreover, it was also given me to say to them that by such conversation the infernals can learn about their own natures, for being corporeal they know no otherwise than that they are in the life of the body. Thus they can be instructed about themselves. And furthermore, because they are in hell, they are rather to be pitied than that any evil should be done to them. For if I were not to speak to them, or if I were to say harsh things to them in the manner that certain souls have contracted from their life in the body, they would then suffer additional torments. This would be contrary to mercy and charity, for it is Christian to wish well even to devils. Besides this, I had known some of them during their lifetime, and it was not then thought that they would become infernals.
1246. De infernali turba in Camera obscura
De infernali turba dolosa in hac camera a tergo fere, prius videas [909], ubi nihil aliud agunt, quam consultant, quomodo fraudulenter decipiant eos, qui iis obveniunt, cum hac turba loquutus sum, quod aliqui mirati, quod cum iis loqui permitteretur, sed respondi, quod mihi id concessum sit, etiam cum pessimis diabolis, quia mihi nihil nocere possunt, aliter si nocere possent, tunc aversatio adest, ac timor, nullus autem mihi timor inesse pro iis potest, quia a Domino tutus sum; quare nusquam cum diabolis, si loqui mecum vellent, id vetitum est, ut quoque scirem, qualis eorum vita quale infernum; praeterea etiam iis dicere dabatur, quod per colloquutionem cum iis, scire possunt quales sunt, ii enim non aliter sciunt, quam quod in vita corporis sint, nam corporei sunt; praeterea quod sic de semet instrui queant: ac praeterea quia sunt in inferno, potius miserendum est, quam iis aliquid malum faciendum, si enim non loquerer si dura loquerer, sicut quaedam animae ex vita corporis secum traxerunt, tunc superadderentur iis supplicia, quod contra misericordiam charitatem foret, nam etiam iis bene velle, christianum est: praeterea quoque quidam in vita mihi cogniti non creditum, quod infernales fierent, erant.